spk_0
If you cannot govern your party, how can you govern a country of 27 million?
spk_0
David Little prouder move was clearly calculated.
spk_0
He wanted to demonstrate obviously his strength, both to his party and to the voters, the base, right, and that's very important, and to show that the Nationals won't be taken for granted.
spk_1
في المشهد السياسي الأسترالي، لطالما شكل الائتلاف بين حزبي الأحرار والوطنيين العمود الفقري لليمين السياسي تحالف صمد أمام تغير القيادات والظروف، لكنه اليوم يمر بواحدة من أكثر مراحله هشاشة وتعقيدا منذ عقود.
spk_1
خلال أيام قليلة، تحول خلاف سياسي حول قوانين خطاب الكراهية وضبط السلاح، والتي طرحت بسرعة بعد هجوم بونداي الذي وصفته السلطات بالإرهابي، تحول إلى أزمة ثقة مفتوحة داخل الائتلاف. أزمة كشفت سوء إدارة للخلافات وتضاربا في المواقف، وانتهت بانسحاب الوطنيين من الائتلاف للمرة الثانية خلال أقل من عام والثالثة.
spk_1
فقط في تاريخ العلاقة بين الحزبين. القصة بدأت عندما دفعت زعيمة المعارضة وزعيمة حزب الأحرار سوزان لي باتجاه إعادة انعقاد البرلمان مبكرا، في خطوة رأى فيها كثيرون داخل حزبها تغليبا للتكتيك السياسي على الرؤية الإستراتيجية، ما أتاح لحكومة أنتوني ألبانيزي طرح حزمة تشريعية شاملة وضعت المعارضة في مأزق، إذ لم يكن هناك.
spk_1
موقف موحد داخل الائتلاف حولها. ورغم تفاهمات أولية بين الأحرار والوطنيين على رفض قوانين السلاح والسعي لتعديل قوانين خطاب الكراهية، انهار الاتفاق وسط اتهامات متبادلة، وبلغ الارتباك ذروته عندما صوت الوطنيون بثلاثة اتجاهات مختلفة في مجلس النواب، قبل أن يعارضوا القوانين في مجلس الشيوخ، فيما صوت الأحرار إلى جانب الحكومة العمالية.
spk_1
وجاءت اللحظة الأخطر عندما ربط زعيم الوطنيين ديفد لي براود أي عودة للائتلاف بإقالة سوزان لي من زعامة الأحرار في تصعيد غير مسبوق حول الغضب داخل الأحرار نحو شريكه السابق وعمق الشرخة بدل احتوائه اليوم، ومع تصاعد الحديث عن انقلاب قيادي محتمل داخل حزب.
spk_1
الأحرار وعودة أسماء مثل أنغس تايلر وأندرو هيستي للواجهة، يبرز سؤال يتجاوز الأشخاص والاصطفافات هل ما نشهده اليوم أزمة قيادة عابرة أم بداية إعادة تشكيل حقيقية لليمين السياسي في أستراليا في ظل صعود قوى شعبوية وتراجع ثقة الناخبين التقليديين لمناق.
spk_1
هذا المشهد يسعدني أن أستضيف العضو السابق في مجلس بلدية ليفربول الناشط السياسي والعضو السابق في حزب الأحرار الأستاذ.
spk_0
Thank you very much, Fares for
spk_0
شكرا جزيلا على استضافك.
spk_1
المعاملة. أنت كنت عضو سابق بحزب الأحرار ولفت نظري.
spk_1
Post on social media.
spk_1
أنا بطلت بحزب الأحرار لغيت العضوية لأن الحزب بطل زي ما كان وحاسس أنه عم تراجع لورا ووضع عم يصير أسوأ اليوم أنت عم تشوف اللي عم يصير كيف عم تتطلع اليوم على الكوالي وعلى هذا؟ ليش برأيك صار
spk_0
Decide to leave the Liberal Party lightly. It took me a long time and a lot of patience hoping that the Liberal Party would be the party that I've joined 20 years ago. I think it started back in COVID days when Scott Morrison, if you remember that, has appointed himself to 4 or 5 portfolios and he was very secretive about it. I think only the Governor General knew, but not the public. And of course, as we know, the Australian public.
spk_0
Would like the uh elected official to be very transparent. Now, through that, when people did find out, er what he's done, etc. uh uh dishonesty and and trying to hide things from the public, that started the downfall of Liberal Party. I think the Liberal Party have lost uh their uh drifted away from the urban,
spk_0
Voters and have not been able to gain that momentum. Peter Dutton, the way he ran his campaign was very one-sided, and he came across as a offensive at times to a multicultural.
spk_0
People and that till today has not recovered.
spk_1
Susan Ley, she's also facing criticism. People are saying she's taking a tactical rather than a strategic approach and Bahra.
spk_1
بعيد ما عندها كثير يعني بالآخر.
spk_1
She still has to deal with the consequences of the last federal election, limited options. The Mafia has support.
spk_1
جوا الحزب كمان طلع أسماء كثير جوا الحزب وعارضوها صراحة شو برأيي.
spk_1
كل يوم المشكلة الأساسية لسوزان لي ليه مش عم تقدر تخلي الائتلاف موجود مثلا كيف تقيم سوزان لي.
spk_0
this is definitely more than a passing disagreement. Sussan Ley inherited the massive problem before the Liberal Party had major issues. The Liberal and Nationals have always had tension. That's not new. What is new is how openly
spk_0
This has played out now. Once dispute moved from a private negotiations and politics to public ultimatums Trust takes a real hit, not because of Sussan Ley's fault. It's the previous leaders and the damage that was created.
spk_1
اللي بعد الليبرال هل الأد عن قاعدته الانتخابية.
spk_1
التقليدية في ناس عم يحكوا الناس عم تتذكر أيام توني أبت جون هاورد وشخصيات يعني كانت قبول عند الأستراليين حتى نجيب بوب هوك وغيره عندهم إرث يعني وسي وحتى الليبرال كانوا يطلعوا عليهم بطريقة معينة الناس اللي عم يحكوا في الفترة.
spk_1
بالليبرال بارتي ما في هذا النوع من الشخصيات؟ شو رأيك؟ هل الأستراليين أنت من خبرتك هون يعني بالمشهد السياسي يتعلقوا بالشخص أكثر ولا تطلعوا الحزب كحزب.
spk_0
Faris really in today's politics there's no real people. Politicians feel entitled to that position. They're not talking people's language. They're not talking the talk.
spk_0
Walking the walk, they kind of feel they're rising above the ordinary people like yourself and mine, and that has become a problem. Why this disconnection between our politicians who are supposed to be real and they're supposed to be connecting with the grassroots. It's funny, I was reading an article for Angus Taylor. He goes, we need leadership. Talk plain language, understand people. Oh, and I went.
spk_0
Reading that I'm going, oh interesting, some leaders talking plain language connecting to people. Well that's a good sign, but why liberals have not connected and lost their massive base
spk_1
which contender, if you're talking Angus Dett or Andrew Hastie?
spk_1
I realistically positioned to consolidate support and emerge as the dominant force who can steer the party's agenda amid such such turbulence. Look
spk_0
at the background of Andrew Hastings and Angus Taylor. I've met Angus Taylor on maybe 234 occasions. They haven't done much, you know. You have to have a leader, and that's where again.
spk_0
The current leader's struggling. You need to have people around you. Angus Taylor was a treasurer. Now if I was going to go by the papers, they'd say that it was very unproductive in his portfolio, and this is a major problem again for the Liberals that they cannot even find a leader and they've lost their identity. And that was a big frustration for me as a Liberal member and elected local government for nearly 10 years. Are we saying that all we have now
spk_0
Two people in the Liberal Party, Angus Taylor or Andrew Hastings, that is a problem.
spk_1
If this separation continues, could it possibly offer the Liberal Party an opportunity to redefine the political identity and reconnect with the lost voters that you're talking about, or the Liberal Party will find itself in a position where they have to make compromises to reconnect with the Nationals?
spk_0
David Little proud move was clearly calculated.
spk_0
He wanted to demonstrate obviously his strength, both to his party and to the voters, the base, right, and that's very important, and to show that the Nationals won't be taken for granted, and understandable from that narrow perspective, you can see logic, but tying any reunion to removal of a leader was a major escalation, and this is the problem now with the Liberal Party.
spk_0
They cannot find their identity, shifted the dispute from policy and structural personality. Once you do that, compromise becomes much harder because people start defending positions rather than solving the problem.
spk_1
Recent reports are saying little proud has refused to confirm reports that he demanded.
spk_1
Sussan Ley resigned and insisted the coalition could be reunited, leaving the door open. Do you see the split just continuing for good? That's it. And the emergence of new political powers.
spk_0
Parties look at numbers. End of the day, they want to win government and they'll kiss and make good in the most difficult circumstances to win elections. Behind closed doors. There's a lot goes on. The fact of the matter.
spk_0
Is it got to that that they're airing their division to the public, that doesn't give them any credibility, even if they did kiss and make good, it's going to take a long time for both of them. Lee, a little proud to resonate back with their voters. The voters, the way they look at it is, if you cannot govern your party, how can you govern a country of 27
spk_1
million? One Nation leader Pauline Hanson.
spk_1
has outlined her party's path to government in a recent interview. She said, yes, it is possible we can do it. She signalled partnership with the Nationals and around the world, right wing parties have been surging in the UK, Nigel Farage, in Italy, Giorgio Meloni, of course, the American president Donald Trump and the MGA movement. Is Australia different
spk_0
to a certain extent?
spk_0
Yes, I think Australia still holds as probably one of the best multicultural moderate country in the world. Again, it's a very interesting question. In my humble opinion, Pauline Hanson, One Nation leader years ago used to kind of crack jokes. You know why? Because she was plain talk, plain language.
spk_0
She was talking the people's language and talking about people's pains and gains. She wasn't parading as a politician to a majority of her party, and One Nation absolutely looms large in this story, particularly in regional and outer suburb seats. The Nationals are under constant pressure from that.
spk_0
And they're very, very sensitive to cultural and identity base and issues. That's what, you know, part of the problem is that Pauline Hanson is stepping in and taking votes from the Liberals, which is very dissatisfied with the Liberal Party at the moment, and I may say that the Liberal Party is on.
spk_0
Local level, local government, state government, and federal government, and that is a big problem. So the treaties of government, people seem to be dissatisfied with. Why did they split, you know, is it the hate speech laws? This wasn't just about the legal details. It was about how those laws are perceived by voters who already feel disconnected from the metropolitan politics. The Nationals didn't want to be seen siding with that.
spk_0
Their base might be our view as an inner city or the progressive priority. So a lot of this hardening of position was about.
spk_0
Electoral signalling reassuring voters that the parties still reflect their values, which is they have a right to do that. It's going to take a long time for them to recover.h
spk_1
thank you for your time on SBS Arabic.
spk_0
Thank you and I wish you all the
