The former right-hand-man of ex-union leader Bruce Wilson used his boss's signature stamp on cheques, the royal commission into union corruption has heard.
Mr Wilson's former secretary Christine Campbell told the inquiry she was unable to shed any light on how Ralph Blewitt had obtained the stamp.
Ms Campbell wanted the stamp made to save Mr Wilson time with general Australian Workers' Union correspondence, but he was reluctant, so she had done some "fast talking" to convince him.
She told him she would keep it in her handbag at all times.
On Monday, she told the commission she did not give the stamp to Mr Blewitt.
"I don't know where he got it from and what he was using it for," she said.
"It went with me in my bag all the time."
Mr Blewitt, Mr Wilson's former offsider at the AWU and a confessed bagman, told the Royal Commission into Trade Union Governance and Corruption earlier this month that his ex-boss used a union slush fund to renovate the home of his then-girlfriend Julia Gillard in the early 1990s.
Mr Wilson repeatedly denied the accusation.
Asked about the relationship between the men, Ms Campbell baulked at the suggestion Mr Wilson had intimidated Mr Blewitt, saying they were close friends outside work.
Ms Campbell, who worked for Mr Wilson in Perth in the early 1990s, said Mr Blewitt was in fact the one who had bullied staff and described him as "a bit mad".
"If anyone was threatening people in their jobs, it would have been Ralph," she said.
Ms Campbell claimed that after Mr Wilson went to work for the union in Melbourne, there had been reports of sexual harassment in the workplace against Mr Blewitt, but "Bruce came back and sorted it out".
She also claimed Mr Blewitt had at one stage come into work unshaven and smelling of whisky, telling her he had done it deliberately in a bid to look like an alcoholic so he could get a permanent disability pension.
The hearing was also told by former Woodside employee Colin Gibson, who had dealings with both men, that he and his then-boss Chris Cronin had laughed at how Mr Blewitt had been ordered by Mr Wilson to get them all coffees and was the clear "underling".
The hearing continues.
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